Best way to learn/train aikido

[Adam]

Here's an age old aikido question:

What do you think is essential in efficiently learning aikido techniques?

Or:

Is it possible to learn the techniques of aikido easily?

And:

Can you explain your answer in three sentences or less? Oh ... and as an extra challenge, please refrain from using phrases such as, "extend ki", "keep one-point", etc.

[vvolfgang]

Hmm...    :-/

I've always lumped "efficient" and "effective" together, two sides of the same coin.

IMHO, there are many factors that impact or enhance the quality of learning, Aikido or otherwise.  Ranging from mundane external factors such as the temperature of the learning environment , all the way to opposit end of the spectrum where internal factors like an instructor reaching "self-actualization" level of maturity...

Personally, I think Attitude is key.  Both Teacher and Student must desire the transfer of knowledge.  Otherwise only limited success is achievable, at best...

Jason
"Taste Like Chicken!"

[Adam]

Personally, I think Attitude is key.  Both Teacher and Student must desire the transfer of knowledge.

Okay. Given the correct attitude is there, what is the best way to transfer that knowledge?

[T. K.]

Good question. How to learn anything "effciently", even when the attitude is already in place?  

Adam, what is the specific challenge? Is it learning a lot of techniques, fast? Or is it learning each technique well, fast? Or is it something else?

P.S. I think there is much difference between "efficient" and "effective", and "mastering" requires both efficiency and effectiveness.

T. K.

[Adam]

Adam, what is the specific challenge? Is it learning a lot of techniques, fast? Or is it learning each technique well, fast? Or is it something else?

The subject line of this thread is also part of the question.

The challenge is in learning how to train, not necessarily learning the most techniques in the shortest amount of time. But it can be a mix. I'll post again later with my three sentences. Gotta run, for now.

thanks.

[vvolfgang]

Given that I am still a novice Aikidoka, I can only draw  from other training experiences... so, YMMV (Your mileage may vary)

I'd have to say two high-level tasks must be done nearly in parallel and in such a sequence that each task reinforce each other.

1.  Philosophical learning, it's critical to understand the "why", and then lead into

2.  Demonstration/Performance, to illustrate the "how and when", which further reinforce the "whys"

The process would be repeated for each pre-determined level of difficulty, with a measurement step between each levels to validate what was intended to be learned....

I think this method, which is a common practice in one variation or another, is still a much-prefered way to use for a performing art then any other way.  Is there a better way?  There may be, I'll never be too old to learn.    I've experimented with different tools to aid in teaching, but each time I'm lead back to this.

Personally, my reading of "Aikido and The Dynamic Sphere" partially satisfies #1 above, but knowing HOW to rebuild a car is not the same as rebuilding a car.  I'm looking forward to #2.

Jason
"Taste Like Chicken!"

[Adam]

Two good points, Jason.

For me (and it's not an original thought), the key to learning aikido efficiently, effectively, optimally, etc., is learning how to train.

To learn how to train, you must learn how to cooperate.

To cooperate, you need to learn how not to fight or compete, in the context of what we're doing in the dojo.

There, that's as simple as I can put it.

You can add subsets to cooperation. Number one would be Safety. For safety, you need to practice and learn cooperative ukemi. For nage to train safely, they must not abuse the gift of cooperation that uke has given them, and therefore cooperate with uke. Nage and uke then learn it's a give-give interaction. This all helps to remove many of the road blocks in learning aikido.

I'll leave it at that, for the moment.

Next?

[T. K.]

Good point with cooperation. The next question is "how to teach/learn not to fight or compete?".

We are hoping that all who train in the dojo will possess the right attitude that reflects the essence of Aikido. However, some might not cultivate the spirit of cooperation for a long time (it can be as long as a lifetime) that is their journey to travel. This is one of the reasons we train with them, being their "uke" on their path to learn cooperation.

We fight with ourselves and the world constantly. Most of the education system is based on competition. Most of our work place is based on competition. Our survival in the world is based on competition. We are always taught to "make things happen", "to DO better than others". It is a challenge for us to step onto the mat at the end of the day and see the world and ourselves totally different. The training expands beyond the mat.  

In my humble opinion, teaching respect is important for teaching cooperation. Respect yourself, your partner, and your teacher, and respect the law of nature that governs all the "techniques".

With respect of self, there will be more positive attitude and no need to compare and compete on the mat. With respect of self and others, comes protection and safety is a natural priority. With respect of the law of the nature, comes relaxation, knowing how things work together, there will be less of "DO the technique", less "forcing", or no more "I am defending myself, I HAVE TO MAKE them go down".

As for cooperative ukemi, it is the other side of the coin. Respect yourself so that you are willing to go down when necessary. Respect others so that you volunteer your help and consider their capability as a nage. Respect the law of the nature so that you make an effort to mimic the real attack and following through well. (Easier said than done, as someone put it "ukemi is 99% of Aikido".  )

With respect in mind, uke will adapt to nage, nage will adjust to uke. Safety is a natural result, as well as progression. (What a wonderful world.  )

Going back to the original question, "How to learn" is an acquired skill. "How to learn" varies from person to person. A challenge to the teacher is to find the learning style of a particular student, and adjust the knowledge transfer accordingly.

Everyone "fight" the technique for a different reason and in a different way. There is always a key issue at a particular stage that is blocking the progress. One way to improve effectiveness of  training is to focus on this issue until the new habit is formed to the desirable degree, then focus on the next one that arises.

The other part of the "How to learn" is that the student needs to adjust to the teacher's teaching style as well. Most people trained with a dojo for a while have already found a "match" of style. The rest is fine tuning to each teacher's style.

The teaching and learning process is as dynamic as the Universe itself, especially when each student AND each teacher progress in their own way and their own speed. Forever, we travel together on the path to Mind and Body Unification.  

[J. Nachtrab]

Is it possible to learn the techniques of aikido easily?

Depends on what you mean by "easily".  Technique can be learned efficiently and without undo struggle, but not quickly.  Learning any technique, be it aikido or dance or mountain biking, requires a certain level of muscle memory to be internalized.  There is no substitute for repetition and rote practice when it comes to this.

What do you think is essential in efficiently learning aikido techniques?  Can you explain your answer in three sentences or less?

Not without sounding like an obtuse haiku, but I'll try to be brief.  I also have a somewhat less cerebral approach.

Aikido technique is different from other physical skills in that it requires not only precise movement but also great emphasis on timing, rhythm, and spacing.  This is why learning aikido technique requires a great deal of cooperation from both uke and nage, and why to non-practitioners it looks like uke is just "going along with it" in the beginning levels.  They are, because at first that's the only way to correctly learn the techniques.  Both uke and nage need to be aware of this learning process, and train accordingly.  Senior ukes provide a great source of instruction, as they are better able to "direct" the technique or throw in the proper direction.  

It is also my opinion that it is incumbent upon ukes, particularly seniors, to continually challenge nage to the best of their ability.  Without pushing uke toward their limit, aikido training runs the risk of becoming a mindless "going through the motions" without providing any real value.  Conversely, performing the technique to the best of uke's ability provides a continuous challenge to nage and refinement of their ukemi ability.

[vvolfgang]

Silently Nagi Prays,
Flash of Movement Frames thought,
Tripped on Hakama.

[T. K.]

The posting of "body awareness" for beginners by Peter A Goldsbury had made my Aikido learning "easier". (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2854  posted 11-13-2002)

Simply, know where your head and feet are during movement.  

Often when I try to learn or improve a technique, I think constantly about what I should be doing, and the focus is up on my head or on my hands, etc. It is interesting that when I pay attention to my head and toes at the same time, the mind automatically "sees" the rest of my body as well. Much easier to make the right moves and maintain one-point.

Developing body awareness improves my mind and body coordination during movement. Expanding it also increases my awareness of my partner's body position in motion. It is easier to do the technique. With practice, this becomes second nature, just like Aikido techniques...  

This helps me playing pool also.

[Adam]

Depends on what you mean by "easily".

Maybe not the best choice of words. Too provocative. I do however, think there is always an easier way or better way.

Senior ukes provide a great source of instruction, as they are better able to "direct" the technique or throw in the proper direction...

It is also my opinion that it is incumbent upon ukes, particularly seniors, to continually challenge nage to the best of their ability.

Although I agree, what is the challenge presented? There are many different interpretations on how to challenge. Not to mention, knowing the difference between challenging and competing. Sometimes an uke will wait to have something done to them, to see if nage can do ... whatever. That road can stray quickly into a competition and be interpreted as a "fight." At higher levels, I don't think ukemi offers new challenges per se, it just becomes more refined and consistent.

While training, uke and nage need to take care of each other, yet worry first about what they themselves need to work on, not what they think the other person needs to work on. My personal goal as uke, is to fit into whatever interaction is taking place, complete my intention if possible, and listen to nage. For the most part – that for nage (and uke) – is challenging enough.

Good stuff!   Thanks for contributing, guys. Keep it coming!

[Adam]

As for cooperative ukemi, it is the other side of the coin. Respect yourself so that you are willing to go down when necessary. Respect others so that you volunteer your help and consider their capability as a nage. Respect the law of the nature so that you make an effort to mimic the real attack and following through well. (Easier said than done, as someone put it "ukemi is 99% of Aikido".  )
 
With respect in mind, uke will adapt to nage, nage will adjust to uke. Safety is a natural result, as well as progression. (What a wonderful world.  )

I just wanted that good bit repeated.

Do we not then just become mirrors of one another, in a sense, revealing our strengths and weaknesses?

[T. K.]

Ah-ha! "TA ME" -- The Mirror.

That is why we chant about it when we ring the bell! Thanks, Adam!

(we need a Smiley for "Ah-ha!"  )

[J. Nachtrab]

Although I agree, what is the challenge presented? There are many different interpretations on how to challenge. Not to mention, knowing the difference between challenging and competing.

Challenging by forcing nage to perform techniques, adjust spacing, and adopt timing that is the most efficient and effective, according to their ability.  Challenging as a means of helping them to continually grow and develop.  Every time you step on the mat, it's an opportunity to meet new obstacles and develop new understanding of how best to move and face threats through aikido.  That cannot happen if the obstacles and challenges never change, never progress.  It just becomes a useless exercise in repetition.

Sometimes an uke will wait to have something done to them, to see if nage can do ... whatever. That road can stray quickly into a competition and be interpreted as a "fight."

Perhaps, if uke's intent is wrong.  I don't know where "competition" got to be such a bad word, but a certain level of struggle is mandatory if training is to have any value.  Uke might wait to see if the technique is performed properly, or if nage is at least moving in the right direction.  To avoid any semblance of direct challenge to nage because it's "fighting" is worse than useless, it's detrimental.  That road might lead away from fighting but it leads to a student who has no real understanding of aikido.

The point of aikido training is to meet physical threats with calmness and softness and to redirect those threats away from us in the least violent way possible.  Ki Society builds on that by using it as a means of developing a set of mind and body coordination skills to be applied to daily life and to help achieve your fullest potential.  It's the point of nearly all forms of budo.  The goal is not to learn to move in fancily complicated patterns of up and down.  

At higher levels, I don't think ukemi offers new challenges per se, it just becomes more refined and consistent.

I would counter that making ukemi more refined and consistent is the challenge.  The mechanics of ukemi may have been learned and integrated - the challenge now becomes, as you said, refining it, making it consistent, being able to apply it to unpredictable situations, etc.  If there's no longer any challenge in something, why keep training?  You're a master.

While training, uke and nage need to take care of each other, yet worry first about what they themselves need to work on, not what they think the other person needs to work on.

At yudansha level I would agree with you to some degree.  Below that I think it's selfish and ultimately counterproductive.  Beginning or even intermediate students learn much more quickly with constant input and guidance from those more senior.  In a class of 5 or 6, the instructor cannot give individual attention to everyone all of the time.  Ki Society and other aikido schools in the U.S. often don't adopt the formal kohai/sempai relationship that is found in other arts, but the underlying nature is there.  "What you learn today you can teach another tomorrow."  For uke, particularly a senior, to practice with nage and give no thought or attention to what they're doing or how they're moving is wasting an opportunity.  First and foremost be concerned with your own contribution to practice, sure, but be aware of their actions and help guide them to the understanding they're looking for.  Otherwise, you're just contributing to the development and prolonging of bad habits and dead ends.  

When I started training in aikido, there were a handful out of many other students who always made training a challenge - they exposed weaknesses in my movement, they forced me to perform the techniques correctly, they refused to yield to force or muscling, they always pushed me to the point where I was slightly uncomfortable.  At first I disliked working with them because I was just that - uncomfortable.  It didn't take long to realize that they were providing the most valuable service to me and to the dojo as a whole.  They forced me to get better.  They forced me to think about what I was doing and figure out how to fix it.  There were plenty of people who went through the motions and "fell down when they were supposed to".  After a time I realized that wasn't aikido training.  It was just exercise.